"'slickwater fracking' is the work of the Devil and that's all there is to it."

No, slickwater fracking is the work of wall street conmen hucksters that would sacrifice everybody else, so long as their stock goes up. And that's all there is to it.

"any point you make"

You haven't made any points. What points did you make? You go around flattering yourself and think you have made points? And that comment is an example of my unreasonable lack of admitting a point? Wow, I am one bad dude. Yea, if you don't toe the line, at least a little bit, then you don't add value. Yea, a guy has got to go along a little bit. Admit to a little bit of intellectual sleight of hand. Otherwise you wouldn't be 'normal'.

"To replicant 'slickwater fracking' is the work of the Devil and that's all there is to it."

No, it is the result of wall street conmen, hucksters, wealthy self interest and lowly gullible investors who are told it's the next best thing to sliced bread. It will save England and keep everyone warm at night. It's the second coming for sure.

"Here is a randomly selected sample from a replicant comment..."

That's an example of my horrendous comments? If you can't see something that rest of the world has no trouble with how in the world is that my fault?

These are 'value added' comments from who I would presume to be a value added poster.

brainless troll, I do hope you receive a reward from the mother ship

"slickwater",which is just another of the bogeymen invented by the eco-nutters to steer us all off fracking.

a cretin or, worse, a committed conspiracy theorist.

I get called a 'conspiracy theorist', which is worse than a cretin', by a conspiracist.

"The genesis of the present scare lies with the likes of Maurice Strong and the Club of Rome, not to mention all the other pseudo-Malthusians, control freaks and eugenicists"

slickwater fracking' is the work of the Devil and that's all there is to it."

No, slickwater fracking is the work of wall street conmen hucksters that would sacrifice everybody else, so long as their stock goes up. And that's all there is to it.

http://beyondeconomics.org/tag/fracking-diagram/

The Economics Fail:
Low Prices and High Depletion Rates

“We are all losing our shirts today… We’re making no money. It’s all in the red.” Despite its commercials, this is what ExxonMobil CEO Rex Tillerson said in July, 2012 to the Council on Foreign Relations.

http://oilprice.com/Interviews/Dont-Fall-for-the-Shale-Boom-Hype-Chris-Martenson-Interview.html

Don't Fall for the Shale Boom Hype - Chris Martenson Interview

http://oilprice.com/Interviews/Shale-Gas-Will-be-the-Next-Bubble-to-Pop-An-Interview-with-Arthur-Berman.html

The second thing that nobody thinks very much about is the decline rates shale reservoirs experience. Well, I've looked at this. The decline rates are incredibly high. In the Eagleford shale, which is supposed to be the mother of all shale oil plays, the annual decline rate is higher than 42%.

SHALE AND WALL STREET: WAS THE DECLINE IN NATURAL GAS PRICES ORCHESTRATED? FEBRUARY 2013
Deborah Rogers

http://shalebubble.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/SWS-report-FINAL.pdf

M'lud, I rest my case.

What case?
What point?

If replicant isn't computer bot, he makes a good impression of the first person to be infected with a bot virus.

I do think there might be value in demanding an off topic discussion form it's own thread. I'm guilty of it too. But yes, most post invaders do add value because people with different views spur us to examine our own standpoints. Debates had here, aid us in the real world beause they force us to research answers we'd normally be unable to use in a real time conversation.

Martin

"Not really a person you can debate with - any point you make will be dismissed"

"slickwater fracking' is the work of the Devil and that's all there is to it."

Well I am certainly waiting for any points to be made that I have dismissed. Of course to have a point, one first needs to make a point. Petty and hollow meaningless accusation are part and parcel of disingenuous posters. But id I failed to acknowledge the valuable point you made concerning fracking, please, by all means, correct me.

http://www.desmogblog.com/2014/03/04/view-europe-america-s-shale-boom-looks-more-blip

The View from Europe: America’s Shale Boom Looks More Like a Blip

The costs of the drilling boom have been well documented. State regulators have struggled to keep pace with the oil and gas industry, and the country is now dotted with sites where land or water were contaminated by spills and other accidents, where gas wells, trains or pipelines have exploded, or where locals say air and water pollution has left them with a range of health problems.

Even the CEO of ExxonMobil, Rex Tillerson, has objected to the industry’s arrival in his own neighborhood, citing traffic jams and harm to property values.

“The amount of jobs created by the gas boom has been grossly overstated,” explained Mr. Powers.

http://www.desmogblog.com/2013/02/19/fracking-wall-street-housing-bubble

Reports: Shale Gas Bubble Looms, Aided by Wall Street

Playing the role of Cassandra, the reports conclude that "the so-called shale revolution is nothing more than a bubble, driven by record levels of drilling, speculative lease & flip practices on the part of shale energy companies, fee-driven promotion by the same investment banks that fomented the housing bubble..." a summary details. "Geological and economic constraints – not to mention the very serious environmental and health impacts of drilling – mean that shale gas and shale oil (tight oil) are far from the solution to our energy woes.

But of course, what are points to be made in post on the internet when compared to mere facts. Can't leave those points out.

http://www.ibtimes.com/us-shale-gas-boom-estimates-exaggerated-alternative-energy-advocate-says-natural-gas-reserves

US Shale Gas Boom Estimates Exaggerated

One of the reasons why gas fields are declining in production is what Powers, author of "Cold, Hungry and in the Dark: Exploding the Natural Gas Supply Myth," calls inflated estimates of natural gas reserves.

“Many of the people promoting the 100-year myth were doing it for either financial or political reasons,” Powers said, in reference to the amount of natural gas experts say will last. He added that companies exaggerated the size of the fields so they could sell acreage to latecomers.

“The write-downs of the last few years have largely proven this out,” Powers said. “More importantly, if shale operators are writing down reserves at the rate we've seen, this also speaks volumes about the total recoverability of all shale gas in the United States.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/brendan-demelle/shale-gas-bubble-insiders_b_1199138.html

Shale Gas Bubble: Insiders Suggest Fracking Boom Is a Bust

As news outlets across America take a more rigorous look at shale gas and fracking issues, it’s encouraging to see how the media coverage is finally starting to cut through the oil industry’s misleading rhetoric to explore the realities of the myth of gas as a viable ‘bridge fuel.’

Hey Martin, here's the Devil doing more work. How's your case going?

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-02-20/fracking-boom-leaves-texans-under-a-toxic-cloud.html

Fracking Boom Leaves Texans Under a Toxic Cloud

Chemicals released during oil and gas extraction include hydrogen sulfide, a deadly gas found in abundance in Eagle Ford wells; volatile organic compounds (VOCs) like benzene, a known carcinogen; sulfur dioxide and particulate matter, which irritate the lungs; and other harmful substances such as carbon monoxide and carbon disulfide. VOCs also mix with nitrogen oxides emitted from field equipment to create ozone, a major respiratory hazard.

Studies show that, depending on the concentration and length of exposure, these chemicals can cause a range of ailments, from minor headaches to neurological damage and cancer. People in the Eagle Ford face an added layer of risk: hydrogen sulfide, also known as H2S or sour gas, a naturally occurring component of crude oil and natural gas that lurks underground.

I'm with Tillerson on this one. Best to keep away from this shite at all costs.

Ford face an added layer of risk: hydrogen sulfide, also known as H2S or sour gas, a naturally occurring component of "hard boiled eggs".

You really are a stupid prat replicant

You are undoubtedly one of the value added posters that are so numerous on this site. I wouldn't want to dismiss any points being, so perhaps you could point out your value point so I can respond at the level which to which you deserve.

So if you don't like the value added why don't you go and bother some one else with your unparallelled understanding of toxicity. Whatever you do when you get up tomorrow morning FGS don't eat anything for breakfast. You might be eating something toxic.

Ah, so you have to learn to read first. I didn't say I didn't like it. I said I was wondering what point you were making. [snip]

[Snip]

More value added posting. The fun never stops. But please allow me to try to elevate the discussion just a tad. Now I don't want to go over your head or anything like that. Or God forbid, that I should step on your toes. But here is a report sheet from the oil and gas industry intended to report instances of H2S emissions. It explains current worker safety procedures required on oil well drilling sites.

http://www.toolboxtopics.com/Gen%20Industry/Toxic%20Gas%20in%20Oil%20and%20Gas%20Drilling.htm

"Hydrogen Sulfide gas can be one of the most vicious and deadly hazards in the oil and gas industry."

Loss of consciousness can occur within seconds of exposure to a high concentration of this gas. The only positive means of determining the amount of H2S present is by testing with approved detectors. If H2S is suspected, the concentration must be determined before personnel are allowed in the area. If it is found to be present, the following procedures should be adopted:

We can proceed from here once you have acquired a sufficient level of familiarity with the subject matter.

So I take you have had enough time to gain some idea of the subject. Now we can then move on to the US Department of Labor who presents an "Oil and Gas Well Drilling and Servicing eTool" page. Under General Safety we find -

https://www.osha.gov/SLTC/etools/oilandgas/general_safety/h2s_monitoring.html

Hydrogen Sulfide or sour gas (H2S) is a flammable, colorless gas that is toxic at extremely low concentrations. It is heavier than air, and may accumulate in low-lying areas.

All personnel working in an area where concentrations of Hydrogen Sulfide may exceed the 10 Parts Per Million (PPM) should be provided with training before beginning work assignments.

Fig. 1. Hydrogen sulfide warning sign: Warning Hazardous Area is in yellow letters on a black background. In black letters on a yellow background, the sign says Hydrogen Sulfide, Extreme Health Hazard, Fatal or Harmful if Inhaled.

"However, it smells so bad, that you normally smell it long before it reaches dangerous levels."

Except of course when you don't normally...

"H2S can cause mild irritation of the eyes and throat at 50 to 100 parts per million (ppm); at 500 ppm and higher, H2S can cause unconsciousness, dizziness and possibly death within 15 minutes to an hour of exposure, according to a presentation by Occupational Health & Safety Administration (OSHA). According to OSHA’s website, the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics reported that hydrogen sulfide caused 60 worker deaths between 2001 and 2010."

I know what you mean Martin, I can't understand why the people don't just leave their houses when they get that smell and come back when the company gives the all clear.

Karnes County, in particular, is rich with H2S. According to data that operators have submitted to the Railroad Commission, the county's Person field has an average concentration of 16,399 ppm—16 times the lethal dose—with a maximum concentration of 71,550 ppm. The Panna Maria field has an average concentration of 24,408 ppm and a maximum of 39,000 ppm.

H2S and some other chemicals emitted during oil and gas production are so dangerous that the federal government has developed safety standards for workers who encounter them on a regular basis.

But there are no clear federal standards to protect people living near drilling sites—including children, the sick and the elderly—who intermittently breathe varying amounts of toxic emissions for years on end.

Scientists "really haven't the foggiest idea" how oil and gas development affects public health, said Aaron Bernstein, associate director of the Center for Health and the Global Environment at Harvard University. Bernstein blames the information gap on a lack of monitoring and research, particularly in the rural, less affluent communities where most of the drilling occurs.

"It's not as though there isn't reason to be concerned," he said. "These are industrial activities with known emissions that are known to affect people's health."

Complaints lodged with the TCEQ hint at the scope of air problems in the Eagle Ford.

On Dec. 7, 2011, a woman in Frio County smelled "an oil and rotten egg odor" around 2 a.m. and woke up "with an upset stomach and horrible headaches."

On April 10, 2012, a family in Atascosa County reported an odor "so bad that their lungs feel as if they will burst."

Of course it is not only the Hydrogen sulfide. But just FYI here is a list of fields, which I am presuming to be in the Eagle Ford formation, containing a list of H2S concentrations. Apparently the Eagle Ford has the highest concentrations in the industry.

http://www.rrc.state.tx.us/data/fielddata/h2s/dist1.php

But that isn't my point, just wanted to point out that gas flaring is pronounced in the shale gas business. When H2S is burned it creates SO2 sulfer dioxide. This time from the CCOHS (Canadian Centre for Occupational Health and Safety)

http://www.ccohs.ca/oshanswers/chemicals/chem_profiles/sulfurdi.html

Main Routes of Exposure: Inhalation.

Inhalation: VERY TOXIC, can cause death. Can cause severe irritation of the nose and throat. At high concentrations: can cause life-threatening accumulation of fluid in the lungs (pulmonary edema). Symptoms may include coughing, shortness of breath, difficult breathing and tightness in the chest. A single exposure to a high concentration can cause a long-lasting condition like asthma. If this occurs, many things like other chemicals or cold temperatures can easily irritate the airways. Symptoms may include shortness of breath, tightness in the chest and wheezing. {Reactive Airways Dysfunction Syndrome (RADS)}.
Skin Contact: CORROSIVE. The gas irritates or burns the skin. Permanent scarring can result. Direct contact with the liquefied gas can chill or freeze the skin (frostbite). Symptoms of mild frostbite include numbness, prickling and itching. Symptoms of more severe frostbite include a burning sensation and stiffness. The skin may become waxy white or yellow. Blistering, tissue death and infection may develop in severe cases.
Eye Contact: CORROSIVE. The gas irritates or burns the eyes. Permanent damage including blindness can result. Direct contact with the liquefied gas can freeze the eye. Permanent eye damage or blindness can result.

Well that is certainly a coincidence isn't it. These symptoms seem to be exactly identical to the complaints made by people living near fracked wells. Will wonders never cease. I wonder how that happens.

It's an educational thread.

Excuse me? It is most certainly is an educational thread. You asked, I answered to the best of my knowledge. But you sound like you have an axe to grind.

Is this the extent of your constructive contribution?

Martin

"dismissing the possibility that what we see behind high-flying aircraft are simply vapour trails as simply ridiculous"

Obviously, anybody with a modicum of common sense and basic science understands that the size and extent of vapour trails on modern commercial aircraft are very limited in size. As they were for the first 40 years of their existence. What we seem to have today is mass hallucination. That is when people bother to look up at all. Most people are completely oblivious as to what happens around them, or understand what's happening around them. Just take a look at a few posts above (no shub, not you). There was a juvenile attempt by one poster to lambast me because I thought H2S was any danger. That unfortunately is the average level of today's human knowledge. Well, I suppose he is actually slightly above that level since he at least knows what H2S is. In any case, as you can probably understand, under these circumstances it is a bit trying to have intelligent discourse.