Discussion > Do you Trust the Met Office?
A suggested anthem for the beleaguered Met Office (with sincere apologies to all!)
All we want is some gloom somewhere
Bearing down on the cooling air
Warm clouds, warm hands, warm feet
Oh, wouldn't it be loverly
Fewer veggies for us to eat
Far less coal making far less heat
While windmills whirr the air
I'll commandeer my 'puter chair
The Met Office predicted a warm dry summer for the cold, very wet one we have just experienced. that seems to be par for the course and one of the alleged reasons for the MO being dumped by the BBC.
Ms Slingo is blaming el Nino without explaining why the greatest met outfit on the planet failed to realize that el Nino was affecting our weather.
It really is not good enough and this is the umpteenth completely wrong seasonal forecast. When do we get our money back, or at least an apology?
Like the BBC, the MO squanders our money on overpaying its managers while under-delivering on its primary function.
Perhaps closing down its climate activities would allow its staff to concentrate on the real factors that influence our weather - and ultimately, our climate.
SC - yes el Nino took us all by surprise.
I remember companies who had been contracted to do work explaining why the work was late: "It's because it's the holiday season and most of the staff have taken vacation leave". Something that was not entirely unpredicatable when the delivery date was committed to.
For the Met Office, as I have said before, a team of perhaps 25 competent meteorologists and some support staff should be sufficient. All other activities (eg software development) which are not its core business to be outsourced.
Tomorrow's headline:
Met Office pays out record sums in bonuses.
The MO is in the news again. The next two years will warm to record levels. Slingo was interviewed on Today.
She did a good job of mixing together heat in the oceans, El Nino, build up of CO2, all the other decadal and multidecadal oscillations.
John H commented that when people point out that the computer predictions don't come true they get labeled as deniers.
An analysis of Slingo's speech would be interesting. It seemed to me to be a mixture of facts, spin, unsubstantiated belief and wishful thinking. But then, I am no expert.
SC, the BBC dutifully regurgitated it. Back in 2013 Paul Hudson, possibly the most sensible BBC weather/climate writer at the time relayed the "new" multi-year Met office forecast showing it going up a bit and then back down towards 2019. Of course the uncertainties were large enough to fit in anything other than a significant outright decline over the whole period.
I don't suppose Slingo mentioned that.
Personally, I still suspect that they are all taking a bigger PR risk than they realise by doubling down on alarmist global temperature predictions due to El Niño weather patterns in the run up to the Paris climate-fest. I think the average British voter doesn't pay much attention to the word "global". They pay attention to British weather (which is what they probably think they are paying the Met Office for). A cold winter or poor summer, never improbable, will make them think "The Met Office was wrong again." Slingo is playing with fire.
On a side note, have any other BH regulars recently been seeing regular adverts for "Slingo" on-line gambling? I chuckle every time I see it. :)
You make a good point about the UK public being more bothered about UK weather. I've seen a number of dire warnings about the coming winter being very severe. If this coincides with the MO winding up the rhetoric on the warmest year ever then they could look very stupid indeed.
This, at a time when the government is looking for budgets to cut....
"On a side note, have any other BH regulars recently been seeing regular adverts for "Slingo" on-line gambling?"
Haha - now I understand the drawing heading a recent WUWT posting Another BBQ Summer Fiasco: Met Office Gets It Wrong (Again)
The question mark in the title of the paper that, presumably, Slingo was puffing suggests that the Met Office has been finding it uncomfortable having it pointed out how their predictions are rubbish...
"9 November 2015 - Met Office data for 2015 so far shows that, for the first time, global mean temperature at the Earth's surface is set to reach 1 °C above pre-industrial levels "
http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/news/release/archive/2015/one-degree
In good time for the Paris conference the Met Office claims that we are half way towards the magic two degree increase.
...for the first time, global mean temperature at the Earth's surface is set to reach 1 °C above pre-industrial levels ...
For the first time ever? Really? Do I trust the Met Office? No, not really.
In response to the 2 Deg C nonsense I did a piece for Paul Homewood. It puts into perspective, that 2 degrees is quite meaningless https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2015/11/04/2-degrees-of-madness/
Thought you might like a read.
NielC, very good. Though I think you missed a trick. You could have pointed out that most places on earth undergo changes in temperature of tens of degrees every day! Think of that! It is incredible that life still exists and this is clear proof that global warming of a mere two degrees is nothing to fear. Bring it on!
Raff, we are (we are told) already halfway to two degrees. Yet, so far as I can see, nobody would have even noticed the first degree rise, if it had not been for the IPCC making a song and dance about it.
Paris average July temperature is 20C, Marseille 24C
Paris average January temperature 5C, Marseille 7C
A few degrees seem no big deal.
Martin, that is brilliant! All those thousand working on climate science and they've never noticed that the annual cycle in Paris exceeds likely rises in temperature by an order of magnitude. With one simple observation you have disproved all of the work done over decades on the effect of relatively small changes in temperature on the natural world. Bravo!
You're getting closer, Raff.
Martin A, and a lot of other people, already know that. So do all the climate lame-brains.
Which begs the question 'Why are those ill-educated's trying to convince us that we know nothing about weather and climate, and our experiences, observations, and thoughts, must be disregarded, when we all legitimately experience the real facts every day?'
As a worst case scenario, the Met Office once promised us a "Mediterranean Climate" as punishment for our CO2 sins.
Many rejoiced. With punishment like that, who needs a British climate.
Alas, many people are now very disappointed with the Met Office.
Raff, there were four examples, post industrial times, when the temperatures fell 2 deg C or more.
1828-1855 (27 years) -2.28 Deg C
1846-1879 (33 years) -2.96 Deg C
1921-1963 (42 years) -2.00 Deg C
2006-2010 (4years) -2.00 Deg C
With continuously increasing levels of CO2, how do you explain these cooling periods bases on increasing CO2 increasing temperature theory?
Raff
Yes I have to admit it is surprising how all "those thousand working on climate science" have been able to reveal the effects of climate change on the natural (and the unnatural) world while the rest of us have not even noticed anything unusual.
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NielC, but..., what are you talking...., what pills, but, but... how do you come up with such nonsense? For a start you are talking about CET, which is not, though you seem not to know it, a measure of global temperature. But even accepting that ignorance, there is no discernible sustained drop of 2C between 1921 and 63 (or the other period probably, I haven't checked) - just wibbly-woobly up and down. You seem to be totally deluded.
Martin, you can copy/paste too. Excellent!
Raff - I take it that means you got the point I made.
Raff I never mentioned global temperatures. What I don't understand is how at any point any where at any time apart from seasonal variation, can temperatures go down given CO2 levels are rising. How do you explain any drop in temperature.
NeilC, you mean like today is colder than yesterday and tomorrow might be warmer. If CO2 is so important how does that happen? Duh!
Martin, you didn't seem to make a point. That the annual temperature cycle in Paris and Marseilles exceeds the likely change in average global temperature (or some average temperature field thingamajig as you wanted to call it) is news to nobody. That changing the average global temperature might have widespread effects is news to nobody. Lots of people research such issues. Your truisms don't alter anything.
"Do you Trust the Met Office?"
Quite fascinatingly I am not sure even the MO's employees actually trust their employer any longer.
There was a time when quite a number took up residence in the Bishop's Palace. They provided insight, opinions, data and at times welcome corrections. Their involvement has ceased, on mass. Group think or directive? Enjoy the speculation!
Personally, I only trust in one MO output - The Shipping Forecast.
Updated every 6 hours with actual precise empirical data.
Every other missive from the MO is simply a 'commercial' for their services. Any iffy weather potential is spun, explored and its ability to be 'adverse' is enhanced to the maximum.
They are headline seekers, just the same as the MSM and for exactly the same reason, to sell their products.
Raff, are you suggesting CO2 has very little to do with temperature rise. Maybe you are suggesting the sun (night/day), air mass (water vapour), albedo (cloud type/cover) are more important regulators of temperature.
Some people are claiming that the quiet sun will lead to cooling and it may have started already. If steady cooling does take place the Met office could be in deeper trouble. The government may lose faith in the met office at a time when they are looking for more public expenditure to cut.