Unthreaded
Robert,
I think Hamas made a calculated decision to attack with Democrats in power, knowing full well their hatred of Israel. So the support we see on the surface is exactly that...surface level only.
Lets hope Israel prosecutes this through until its conclusion instead of doing what they have always done in the past...gone so far before worrying about what every is saying about them...then stops...then repeats all this violence again in 4-5 years.
DaveS,
...cowardice and a demonstration of weak leadership, but I wonder in this specific case what others would have done
Indeed. But it becomes a question of who you have to choose from. A resolute Churchill-type would never get into leadership in a modern party (if he made it into politics at all).
Three COVID u-turns by Boris spring to mind (there were probably others): lockdowns, herd immunity, face masks. On each, his initial stance seems to have been the better. What changed his mind?
My hunch is that the advisers — Sir Humphreys saying "courageous" or whatever — had a role in the turnarounds, but his political colleagues were the clincher. The media was stoking fear, more fearful constituents were contacting their MPs, Boris had already "got Brexit done" so if he wouldn't comply with "The Science" (of fearful voters) a new PM could be found. As you say of lockdowns, Boris was "persuaded of their necessity", but for his political survival, not for the benefit of the people.
I think Ferguson himself is fairly peripheral. Woeful research of course, but it was just technical cover for a political decision.
Boris fancied himself to be a bit of a Churchill, and he withstood for a while early on. To me, his full capitulation came with his "the NHS saved my life": an obviously false statement, but also a declaration that he loved Big Brother.
IMO, the biggest driver of all is going to be outside the inquiry: the insane pursuit of Trump in the US. That mania infested the Internet. Whatever Trump said was wrong by definition, never mind if it was right in fact. Internet influencers held sway in the minds of people all around the world.
This lesson hasn't been learnt (indeed the various misinformation initiatives seem to be going in the worst direction possible).
It strikes me that this idea might underlie Hamas's attack. It wasn't going to materially harm Israel, but if a suitable Internet storm were to follow, it might do very serious damage to the US support of Israel. To date the US seems to be supporting solidly enough, but how firm are the Democrats and, Biden being a Democrat himself, how firm are the Republicans?
Dave’s,
An enquiry worth its weight in gold might be minded to examine what correspondence went on between Ferguson and Govt scientists to find out if there was collusion to ramp up the fear with inflated deaths.Be interesting finding out who was speaking to who (did fergusson make the first approach or were “pro-lockdow” people looking for support for their teamwork approac).
"..how deep in the bureaucracy does the rot go?"
One of this week's 'revelations' from the inquiry, which aligned with my impressions at the time so wasn't a surprise, was that Boris was opposed to lockdowns but ultimately was persuaded of their necessity. The infamous Ferguson model prediction seemingly being the key reason for his change of mind. But there does appear to have been support for lockdowns elsewhere in the govt machine before Ferguson popped out of the woodwork. Considering the idea that 'extraordinary measures require extraordinary evidence' there does not appear to have been any due diligence on Ferguson's track record within government circles, yet I recall that across the wider media world it wasn't long before his litany of failed predictions was exposed. The UK govt was not alone in being bounced by Ferguson's paper - the US govt picked up on it but of course over there the federal govt had limited jurisdiction.
I've already seen Boris' change of direction described as cowardice and a demonstration of weak leadership, but I wonder in this specific case what others would have done. If he didn't ask the question "How reliable is Ferguson's prediction?" then there were plenty of people around him who should have done - the scientific advisers, the medical advisers, all the 'special' advisers.
tomo,
Ah yes, that sort of thing is well within Twiggy's repertoire; on the surface he's quirky and affable, but green schemes make good sense to him for the same reasons they make good sense to Gore.
It's nice that the BBC applies their "due impartiality" standards to things other than climate change. Usually the BBC's mini-me, the ABC seems to be reasonably forceful about the Hamas atrocities, even now.
Taken down to the station for disrespecting the Palestinian flag? Appears the police still haven't recovered from COVID. Must be long COVID.
I wonder if the UK hasn't been working on another scheme to reduce off-the-books immigration in case the restrictions in outboard motor imports don't do the trick. When Australia was getting a lot of boat people there was much discussion about "pull factors": it wasn't just that people were fleeing oppression, they were also drawn to our land of milk and honey. Has a plan been adopted to bring the UK up to one or two Haitis on the "shithole" scale? Police incident above has you on your way.
On the UK COVID inquiry, it's fair enough for the buck to stop with Boris — he was PM after all — but as Mailman says, that's not the lesson you need. The buck stops with Boris, but how deep in the bureaucracy does the rot go? Ah, but an inquiry that digs deep? Expectations low.
husq,
Today's links don't cover any new ground and they smack of morning television production values — hearty laughter and all that — more for entertainment and popularity than any depth of thinking. As for Hamas being an invention of the Israelis, so what? The PLO wouldn't have existed either if there hadn't been an Israel. And I'm pretty sure that, if they did create Hamas, the Israelis didn't mean for it to behave as it does. Who's responsible for its acts today? I mean we might regret that Klara Hitler bore little Adolf, but we can hardly hold her responsible for the Holocaust.
While the links are worth a look, I would be interested to hear your *own* views on this sudden flare-up. Mine are mixed — or more mixed than Mailman's at any rate — but I view Israel as having the right at the moment. I'd certainly go further than the mealy-mouthed politicians and say it was even right to fire on the refugee camp if there was a critical target beneath it. Honestly, who is the more callous: the person who fires through the "women and children" or the person who uses them as a shield?
I confess that the accumulation of years has made me cynical, and the Internet hasn't helped any. So much of what I see in the coverage tingles my sceptical sense. So many cameras. So many people running past carrying bloodied toddlers. So many women beating their heads in dismay. I know there is *real* suffering, but alongside it I detect another take on the theatre of war.
At Jo Nova's today is Hertz throttling back on EVs. I watched a Cadogan YouTube on the same topic recently, but Jo makes the important point that if the economics don't work for Hertz with its advantages of scale, it hasn't a chance of working for individual buyers.
Husk.
You’re a broken record 😂 You’re argument basically comes down to “well she deserved to be raped because of how she was dressed”.
Meanwhile Hamas leadership continues to live a life of luxury in Qatar and seem quite happy to killl their people off in their drive to remove every last Jew from the face of the planet. Seems to be quite some benevolent movement you love their big fella.
Palestinian Protesters Are Like Neo-N@zis! Says White House Spokeswoman.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5O0yoMlsCI
This Will Make Your Head Explode - White House Spokesman Just Admits It!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7LPjLbYLY0
Even WOLF BLITZER Is Shocked By Israeli Atrocities!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMmZVIMYPtk
Starmer Asked To Condemn Israeli War Crimes, He REFUSES
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EIyCdapRzfY
Mailman:
>Hamas most certainly COULD build its on power generation and water plants with the BILLIONS given to it by the international community and Iran these last two decades.<
Hamas was helped and funded by Israel since the late 70's.
What do you know about Hamas?
That it’s sworn to destroy Israel? That it’s a terrorist group, proscribed both by the United States and the European Union? That it rules Gaza with an iron fist? That it’s killed hundreds of innocent Israelis with rocket, mortar, and suicide attacks?
But did you also know that Hamas — which is an Arabic acronym for “Islamic Resistance Movement” — would probably not exist today were it not for the Jewish state? That the Israelis helped turn a bunch of fringe Palestinian Islamists in the late 1970s into one of the world’s most notorious militant groups? That Hamas is blowback?
This isn’t a conspiracy theory. Listen to former Israeli officials such as Brig. Gen. Yitzhak Segev, who was the Israeli military governor in Gaza in the early 1980s. Segev later told a New York Times reporter that he had helped finance the Palestinian Islamist movement as a “counterweight” to the secularists and leftists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and the Fatah party, led by Yasser Arafat (who himself referred to Hamas as “a creature of Israel.”)
“The Israeli government gave me a budget,” the retired brigadier general confessed, “and the military government gives to the mosques.”
“Hamas, to my great regret, is Israel’s creation,” Avner Cohen, a former Israeli religious affairs official who worked in Gaza for more than two decades, told the Wall Street Journal in 2009. Back in the mid-1980s, Cohen even wrote an official report to his superiors warning them not to play divide-and-rule in the Occupied Territories, by backing Palestinian Islamists against Palestinian secularists. “I … suggest focusing our efforts on finding ways to break up this monster before this reality jumps in our face,” he wrote.
“Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas,” Netanyahu told his Likud party’s Knesset members in March 2019. “This is part of our strategy"
The above from an article in:
Haaretz | Israel News
Analysis | Another Concept Implodes: Israel Can’t Be Managed by a Criminal Defendant.
you got that right.
Churchill?
Saudi Arabia of Wind?
The deluded shallow lying twat should be banished to a tepee in a foggy bog somewhere in mid Wales "powered" by wind and solar with his idiot missus, the kids and the dog. to support by writing articles for the local paper. (they'd likely all starve to death)
not a fan