Discussion > President Trump
"I wonder if they were dumb enough to elaborate via email?
May 14, 2020 at 2:02 PM tomo"
If anything is found, it will be blame Trump/Russians/Brexiteers/Hackers, and frame someone with faked evidence. The BBC and Guardian will print it as fact.
golf charlie
There was a concerted campaign to deny hydroxychloroquine to US patients
No, there was not. Governors such as Cuomo who restricted the drug's use to inpatients and trials were simply following FDA advice. Hardly a secretive 'briefing', hardly a 'campaign'. Adjust your foil cap.
Anyhoo, thanks for reminding me why I stopped reading WUWT. A remarkably muddled, slanted and contradictory piece even for them. Goldstein in the same article concedes there were shortages of HCQ, while at the same time stating:
HCQ supply from manufacturers was not interrupted at any time. Some manufacturers always had HCQ for sale.
Similarly Governors lack 'the authority to completely ban doctors from prescribing HCQ', but 'The Governor of New York outright denied HCQ to COVID-19 victims, except for inpatient treatment and clinical studies.'
The HCQ shortages were not and could not be caused by the drug’s demand as a COVID-19 treatment. [..]
Because HCQ is safe, it is frequently prescribed for 90 days. Because it is cheap, insurance companies may allow patients to refill the whole 90-day supply at one time. Many lupus patients do not adhere to their regimen (see below) and thus often have unfulfilled prescriptions. Due to the fear sowed by the media, some of these patients rushed to fill their long term HCQ prescriptions, even though they had plenty of unused tablets at home.
The main contradiction/straw man. What does it matter if the shortage was caused by non-COVID patients or COVID patients stockpiling? A shortage is a shortage, and when the author says 'fear stoked by the media', that fear was largely due to the same media reporting Dr Trump's short-lived enthusiasm for (one of the ) 'biggest game changers in the history of medicine'., before he got behind sunbeds and Toilet Duck.
And, to back up his claim of no shortages, Goldstein links to a list of um, shortages.
A quick Google threw up plenty of reports from patients groups and pharmacists of Lupus and Arthritis sufferers unable to get their prescriptions filled: eg Medscape
In the last week, this once obscure drug has been thrust into the national spotlight with everyone from doctors, to laypeople, to the U.S. president weighing in. The attention has so dramatically driven up demand that pharmacists are reporting depleted stocks of the drug, leaving many of the roughly 1.5 million lupus patients across the country unable to get their prescriptions filled. They now face an uncertain future as the public clings to one of the first signs of hope to appear since the coronavirus began sweeping across the U.S.
Never thought I'd have to point out that a person with public influence, during a pandemic, supporting an unproven drug that is relied on by millions of people is unwise, but there you are. Not sure this piece does much to improve the already low credibility of WUWT.
For the avoidance of doubt, I am neither pro or anti-hydroxythingy..., some data indicate efficacy, others none. We need a properly controlled trial with a decent sample size, as I may have already mentioned ;-)
Phil Clarke
"during a pandemic, supporting an unproven drug that is relied on by millions of people is unwise"
quite the opposite, with many people dying. Control group is in the morgue
"some data indicate efficacy, others none" entirely depends on the amount of infection. who'd a thunk it?
easy to ramp up production
repeat of the "toilet duck" joke, based on nowt
"anti-hydroxythingy..." is that a joke, Clarke? no, clarke is a joke
Charly
i wonder if clark watches fox business
https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2020/05/14/president-trump-interview-with-maria-bartiromo-4/
no idea what he is doing, i suppose?
seems some people agree that lockdown does not work -
https://lockdownsceptics.org/
Charly
Predictably Professor Clarky pulls stuff out of his backside to indulge his Orange Man Bad fixation.
Cuomo, Whitmer and Sisolak deployed the FDA guidelines eh ? - I missed that - they must've forgotten to mention it when they were jerking a ban. Does the advice also say that it's OK to put positive tested patients into old folks care homes?
So Doctor Clarky - give us some evidence that things are as you say i.e. "hydroxythingy" is wholly ineffective and dangerous to health - cue wahh! I didn't say that - but you just feed in enough ambivalence to attempt to cover yourself as usual.
Bloviating TDS on stilts with an OMB sandwich board
tomo
Thank you very much. So I asked Bill a question that probably some of you are thinking of, if you’re totally into that world, which I find to be very interesting. So, supposing we hit the body with a tremendous — whether it’s ultraviolet or just very powerful light — and I think you said that that hasn’t been checked, but you’re going to test it. And then I said, supposing you brought the light inside the body, which you can do either through the skin or in some other way, and I think you said you’re going to test that too. It sounds interesting.ACTING UNDER SECRETARY BRYAN: We’ll get to the right folks who could.
THE PRESIDENT: Right. And then I see the disinfectant, where it knocks it out in a minute. One minute. And is there a way we can do something like that, by injection inside or almost a cleaning. Because you see it gets in the lungs and it does a tremendous number on the lungs. So it would be interesting to check that. ...
- Dr Trump.
I can’t believe I have to say this, but please don’t drink bleach.
- Joe Biden (Most-liked tweet of the week ;-).
Is it possible Dr Trump saw this and thought he was watching a documentary?
Phil Clarke
sunlight is the best disinfectant
O3 and UV are good on viruses
( don't read the guardian. rots the brain )
Charly
Clarky
If there was any - and I mean any truth in your f-witted attempt at poisonous levity I'd have some sympathy - but as it stands it rather looks as if you'd prefer to parrot CNN, Vox, Think Progress and the procession of mendacious nitwits that comprise the "progressive" US media.
Have you seen the presentation that preceded Trump's "disinfectant" comment? - I have - I guess you can't be bothered and would rather pleasure yourself with the bleach fantasy.
As usual an ideologue more concerned with attempted political point scoring than veracity and the welfare of victims of coronavirus ... which is where we came in...
tomo
anti-virus:
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-018-21058-w.pdf
anti-virus:
https://www.researchgate.net/post/What_is_the_effect_of_Ozone_Therapy_on_COVID-19_protection
Charly
"on that preceded Trump's "disinfectant" comment? - I have - I guess you can't be bothered and would rather pleasure yourself with the bleach fantasy."
i need the mind bleach
Charly
Shorter Tomo: Everyone with a different viewpoint to me is deranged. (Has that ever worked for you?).
Yes, Trump was referring to an earlier discussion of a disinfectant effective on surfaces. And yes the President of the United States mused openly on air about the possibility of a therapy involving injecting the stuff as a way of 'cleaning' the lungs. Only the presence of cameras stopped Dr Birx from face-palming.
I think a certain degree of derangement is indeed necessary to adopt the role of apologist for this buffoon.
Phil Clarke
I expect Adam Schiff believes in Gergis and Mann's Hockey Stick, he doesn't understand honesty at all.
"Adam Schiff
@RepAdamSchiff
·
Mar 3
To combat climate change effectively, we need to be able to trust the information coming from our government.
Science doesn't lie — but people do lie about science. When it concerns the established scientific consensus, that’s incredibly dangerous.
Truth is truth."
golf charlie
tomo
So Clarky hasn't watched the segment that precedes the disinfectant comment - okie-dokie
tomo
There's a song about Phil Clarke.
Side 3 of "Exile on Main Street". Rolling Stones.
Track 2.
Don't watch CNN. It rots the brain.
Charly
He also features on "Sweet Virginia", track 1 on side 2.
Charly
Just guessing.
We’re also testing disinfectants readily available. We’ve tested bleach, we’ve tested isopropyl alcohol on the virus, specifically in saliva or in respiratory fluids. And I can tell you that bleach will kill the virus in five minutes; isopropyl alcohol will kill the virus in 30 seconds, and that’s with no manipulation, no rubbing — just spraying it on and letting it go. You rub it and it goes away even faster. We’re also looking at other disinfectants, specifically looking at the COVID-19 virus in saliva.
Who could have possibly predicted that a dumbass surrounding himself with sycophants would end up with a moron advocating the study of therapeutic injection of disinfectant?
Well, most people. This actually happened. If Trump is ridiculed, it is because he is genuinely ridiculous.
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-vice-president-pence-members-coronavirus-task-force-press-briefing-31/
Phil Clarke
Who could have possibly predicted that a dumbass surrounding himself with sycophants would end up with a moron advocating the study of therapeutic injection of disinfectant?
May 14, 2020 at 11:07 PM Phil Clarke
I am sure Mann and Gergis could have predicted it, with their Peer Reviewed fakery.
golf charlie
Clarke, you really are as thick as a plank.
Leave home, take a walk, get some sunshine. The risk from wolves is small. But George is working on that.
Charly
"Who could have possibly predicted that a dumbass surrounding himself with sycophants would end up with a moron "
Clarke with his mate Monbiot?
Charly
Clarky doing his traditional parroting of CNN bullet points with some (minor) adlib busking.... easier to be ignorant - ignorance has a certain dignity - fantasy is its own reward.
Still hasn't watched the presentation preferring to sling lumps of ordure and squeal.
tomo
Viva Frei does The Flynn case circus
Judge Sullivan is I feel going to find that he's in deep shit and will be written off by his chums as collateral damage.
#NOPAUSES
tomo
May 15, 2020 at 2:04 AM tomo
I don’t claim to understand US Law, but it seems he is in Contempt of Law, Human Rights and the independence of the Judiciary.
It would be illegal, but a record of the phone numbers he has communicated with over the last month could make interesting reading. It is what Obama would have sanctioned if the roles were reversed.
golf charlie
There was a concerted campaign to deny hydroxychloroquine to US patients - it seemed obvious but somebody has taken the time to scope it out.
The house troll even parroted some of the talking points. Will we see PC address the points in the piece or try to stab the messenger?
Given the similarity of pronouncements by Cuomo,Sisolak and Whitmer in particular it isn't unreasonable to assume that they were briefed from the same source.
The utility of HCQ is still being debated but using the baseline of Hippocratic "do no harm" and the purported therapeutic dosing - an opinion that some folk in the DNC decided to try and shoot down "Orange Man's wonder drug" regardless of its efficacy - has some credibility.
I wonder if they were dumb enough to elaborate via email?